PAPod 527 - Navigating Safety in High-Risk Maritime Operations

Show Transcript

WEBVTT

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Music.

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And welcome to the Pre-Accident Investigation Podcast. I am the host and the

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host, hoster, not hostess, hoster.

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There's gender specific terms for this, isn't there? Well, anyway, I'm the host.

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My name is Todd Conklin and you're about to join us for another exciting episode

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of the Pre-Accident Podcast. And I think it's going to be great fun.

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It is amazing here because this is truly the best time of the year, if you ask me.

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And it's an interesting year for us. I don't know what it's like for you guys,

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but for us in New Mexico, we're almost not having winter.

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I mean, we've had a little snow, no question about it, a little bit of snow. That's been nice.

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But generally, it's been like, you know, in the 50s Fahrenheit, pretty much every day.

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Today, it was like 44, but I mean, I'm not complaining. I'm rounding up because,

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you know, optimists round up. That's what we do.

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But it's been interesting, which means we're probably going to get socked it to us soon.

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And I'll have to be ready for that. But as I say, I think next year,

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I'm going to try not to talk so much about the weather. I can't believe I talk

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about the weather all the time.

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It's weird. It just feels like something that is important to share,

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but I don't have the vaguest clue why.

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And you probably are tired of it, I'm guessing, because you've got your own

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weather and you could talk about it all you want to, to people who also don't care.

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So, I mean, it's kind of like people who take pictures of food and put it on

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Instagram and stuff. I mean, it's great.

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Thanks for sharing. I'm not being ungrateful, but I don't know.

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Pictures of food is not the same as food.

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You know, it's like the phrase we think about all the time in the safety world.

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You know, when you're talking about procedures, and I often say the map is not

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the terrain, right? I mean, I didn't say that.

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Great minds before me in many different modalities have said something like

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that. The map is not the terrain.

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Just like the procedure is not the job, right? I mean, the procedure is the procedure.

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The job is the job. The map's the map. The terrain, the actual terrain is the actual terrain.

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Well, here we go. The picture of your food is not your food.

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It's very different than the food. It's probably calorically better to look

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at it, but it's way less satisfying.

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Because ultimately, I don't know what you quest for, but I'm always kind of

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looking for some combination of salt and fat.

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I need some combination of salt and fat.

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Tocino is a word I would use. And if you need to look that up,

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it's a really important word and you'll need it for international travel.

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It is the quintessential example of salt and fat.

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So how are things going with you, because it is a busy time in the world,

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for sure, and so much is going on.

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I mean, geopolitically, I've really learned two important lessons,

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probably more, actually. It's been a very teachable moment.

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But in the past several years, I've learned two really important lessons.

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One is that progress does not only move in one direction, that progress ebbs

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and flows, Just like organizations ebb and flow.

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I mean, that's a really, we know that at a base level, but it's a really important

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lesson and the universe continually teaches it to us.

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The other thing is that I don't think you should ever say it can't get any worse.

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Because the minute you say it can't get any worse, then generally what happens

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is it actually kind of gets worse.

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And so that's not the best time to hang out either. So those are two lessons

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that I'm being taught and over and over again, I've been taught.

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And so that's important for us to understand. It's interesting time just because

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so much is going on and it's really,

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I don't know how you're doing, but it's kind of exciting to see how the discussion

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around safety and resilience and reliability has changed so much.

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Over time, and that the conversations we have now are much different than the

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conversations we would have had, for instance, 10 years ago.

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And it's interesting because I try to every once in a while toss in a rerun

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podcast because, you know, this podcast has been going 10 years,

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actually longer than 10 years.

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And so you can kind of see the journey.

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But I think what's even more interesting is the journey that the working world

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is taking, and they're kind of coming along with us. It's so much fun.

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To hear companies that I know nothing about, no experience, I mean,

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just to hear people talking about how they've really tried to retool and understand,

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for instance, that the worker isn't the problem, the worker is the solution.

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And that's exciting. I mean, there's something to be said about that idea.

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And that's kind of a part of, well, something's coming up. There's a podcast

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coming up soon where I'm going to

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tease a relatively new idea and kind of introduce Project X version 2024.

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So we could talk a little bit more about that as well, because I'm really excited

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about this project and all the things that are involved in what happens in this project.

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But probably what we should do is talk about today's podcast,

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because I'm really quite pleased to share today's podcast, because we're going

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to meet somebody whom I think you will adore.

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She is an amazing human being, and her name is Bionda van Roosendal Schelling. How'd that sound?

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She's Dutch, and so I tried to say it with kind of Dutchness.

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I probably didn't do a good job, but I didn't do a bad job. I mean,

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that's pretty good. She's a general manager of health, safety,

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and environment at HIRMA, which is a company that you may or may not know.

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And if you don't know, you probably do know. You just don't know you don't know.

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And what they do to a great extent is quite remarkable because they manage these

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heavy lift vessels really around the globe.

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So if something really heavy needs to be moved around in the ocean,

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these are the people who do that.

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And so they do everything from platforms to windmills to ship salvage.

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I mean, and it's a remarkable, it's really an interesting form of work.

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And so when I got the chance to have Beyond on the podcast, I jumped at it.

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In fact, I kind of tricked her. I had her trapped.

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We were in a taxi, and I had her trapped.

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And so I thought, well, this is the chance to do the podcast.

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Now, you're going to notice that it sounds like it was recorded in a taxi because

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it was recorded in a taxi.

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The funniest thing about it is we did the entire conversation, and then we finished.

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And the taxi driver was listening intently to every single word and was completely

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into what we talked about. And we were actually on our way to one of these big vessels.

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And so it was kind of an exciting conversation. But what I found most exciting was how Beyond the End,

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this company have been on this

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journey to look at safety differently in an incredibly high-risk industry.

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No question here at all. The risk levels are giant, kind of like your company.

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I mean, there's no question that it's not risky work.

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What's interesting is how they constantly create capacity at really different

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levels. There's maritime safety capacity.

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There's operational safety capacity. There's industrial safety capacity.

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I mean, they have kind of every hazard all at once. They're at sea on a big

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ship, and they're doing crane hoisting and rigging work.

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There's a lot going on here. And it's so interesting to hear how Bionda talks

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about this in great detail.

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And I love bringing her voice to the public.

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Mostly what I love is introducing her to you. It's a great opportunity to hear

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somebody with a tremendous amount of expertise.

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She is highly qualified, highly skilled, and highly intellectual.

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You can kind of tell from the conversation that I'm pretty impressed with her.

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But maybe the best thing to do is let's listen to it. Here we go.

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Hi, my name is Vilna. I work for Heroma, which is a big installation contractor in the Netherlands.

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That's good. And what's your job for them? I'm a manager at HSC for the Heroma

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Group, actually. So, I actually manage offshore operations, engineering,

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as well as fabrication, because we have a fabrication yard in Flossie.

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Oh, wow. Or Flissing, as we're saying, Dutch. Yeah, in Dutch.

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You can flip in and out of Dutch as much as you, because I won't be able to

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test you. So, it'll all be perfect Dutch.

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But we'll be listening. If there's Dutchies, they will know what I'm saying.

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And there are kind of a lot of Dutchies. Yeah, so I have to be a bit sensible now. So, that's good.

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That's a good thing to do. So, tell me about your journey that you're on right

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now to sort of reinvigorate the safety program.

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It looks like you're in a really cool opportunity. And I'm curious to see how

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that's going, because I'm super curious about your industry.

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And I'm really curious about the approach that's happening in Europe,

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because it's happening kind of all over Europe.

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Yeah, I think especially now in Europe, it's kicking in. And I think we've been

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operating for quite many years, decades even, in complex offshore construction

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and decommissioning and also more recently in renewables.

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And I always try to – people always ask me, okay, you're an agency manager.

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What the hell do you do? Good question, don't you? What the hell do you do?

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I just want to make sure that everybody goes home safely in all forms,

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physically but also mentally.

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So that's kind of the trajectory we're now in, is that phase that is not only

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the physical safety anymore. It's also about that. It's doing it with the people.

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For the people and actually, I think the with the people is the most important

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part because like you always say, it's like people for me are the solution, not the problem.

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So we should listen, shut up for a moment.

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Listen actively, learn from what they have to say, and translate that in what

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kind of work makes the world, the hero world in my life, a better place to work

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and live. But it's so exciting to hear you talk about safety.

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And I mean, there's just a breadth of newness.

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It's like, you don't see safety's job as removing risk.

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You see safety's job as making work better, making work easier to do.

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Is that reflected in the industry? Are you seeing that change in the maritime

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industry? Are you seeing that change across Europe?

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I think it's slowly, slowly but surely. I think the concept's now kicking in.

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I think that's why people were so overly enthusiastic to receive you here in

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the Netherlands, because people are now really seeing, okay,

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hey guys, yeah, yeah, risk is for, but we work in a very high risk environment.

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That will not change. It will not change tomorrow.

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It will not change, I think, in the next decade or so. It's just a fact of life.

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So we need to start working and looking towards different and other things.

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And, you know, it's the people that we're doing this with. Those are the people

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that make the flex vessels work. Those are the people that prepare work.

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Those are the people that are offshore or standing outside in the rain like today.

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That's what we need to focus on. And I think that's the next level.

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It's being conscious of the risk, but also working with the people to understand

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it better and to look towards better ways of working.

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So we're at the International Maritime Contractors Association,

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and there's been a lot of discussion. It's kind of surprising to me on how technology

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is changing operations.

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What are you seeing from your standpoint? Because you work in these highly complex,

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holy cow, your vessels are, they're like science labs. I don't even know how to describe it.

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Yeah, for a certain extent, I agree. Because new technology will definitely

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have an interest with how we do the work. But I see it more as a tool.

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And still, the people that have to operate it, even with AI,

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is how you're prompted, it will come back with whatever you want.

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It will make life a bit more easier in certain aspects.

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But especially in our types of line of work, you cannot kind of know everything beforehand.

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There will be circumstances that you can't plot in. There will be weather that turns.

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There will be other circumstances that will throw things in the mix.

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So it's still people being able to kind of digest all those changes in almost

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a single moment and make the right decisions.

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So, yeah, I see technology as a fantastic tool.

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Makes lives a bit more easier. But it's still the human beings that need to

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work with the technology and be able to make the right and the safe decision

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when things go haywire or things change.

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So that's still the human element will always be there. Yeah,

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I think completely true.

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How are you coaching and mentoring your leaders?

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Be ready to kind of enter this next phase, not just in safety,

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but this next phase in operations?

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Because I think to me, that's such a great question.

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It's also a difficult question. I think sometimes it may be a bit with a bit

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difficulty as well, because of course, I think this morning it was also sad.

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We're living now in a VUCA world where we have multitudes of generations at

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work in a company at any one point in time.

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You have different levels of age and experience of that, different ways of thinking even.

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So it's still a gap to bridge in my perspective, where you kind of have to kind

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of educate the old dynasties to get a bit more close to, let's say,

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the newer generations, but also vice versa to learn the newer generations to

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understand why we do the things we do.

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Because it's not like certain decisions or certain programs,

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certain way of working, they always come from somewhere, right?

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We're not a company, we're not done things has a resident in history.

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So it's good to be notable of that as well. Are leaders, and this isn't,

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because it wouldn't be fair to ask this about your guys, but as a rule,

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are leaders ready for this change?

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I mean, have we given them the right environments and developed them in such

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a way that they're ready for these changes?

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I think some are further along than others. Yeah, I think that's fair.

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And that's why, once it's one-size-fits-all solution, I don't think it's there.

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So for almost each individual it would be different what

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they will need to kind of account for these changes but i

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think the key for me as a person always would be and i always give

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the recommendation just need to be remain curious right you

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want to be you need to keep learning all the time i'm

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never too old to learn i truly live that so i know i don't know everything also

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the seniors of the today they will also not my way they're also human beings

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they will not know everything how do you keep your fellow senior leaders curious

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i mean what are you doing because Because clearly you have access to them and

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they're listening to you.

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I mean, it's kind of an exciting time, for sure. How do you keep them curious?

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I think the way I tend to do it is keep them aware of what is playing around.

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I'm one of those persons, I love to just connect to the front line and learn

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what's bothering them or what they're facing.

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I see myself also maybe as the vehicle that can be used to raise certain topics

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up to senior level as well. The things they might not hear usually in a boardroom

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or whatever, a senior management meeting, but, you know, the true voice of the

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people in the frontline and hopefully helping that.

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Make them understand a bit better and maybe steer the decision in a better way,

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being more conscious of what's kind of the general gist of the feeling of what's

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existing in the company.

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Have you tried to change any of the kind of like the investigation protocols or the audit protocols?

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Have you tried to go in and systemically change any of your old systems to become

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more modern and more curious?

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Actually, we're doing it as we speak. Oh, really? Yeah, because we've seen a

00:16:28.087 --> 00:16:30.567
certain way of reporting of a sponics incidence, for example.

00:16:31.067 --> 00:16:34.787
And we've already seen in last year, we did quite a large investigation into

00:16:34.787 --> 00:16:37.047
an incident trend that we saw coming up.

00:16:37.247 --> 00:16:40.927
And one of the core things that came out of it is we're not learning enough from our events.

00:16:40.947 --> 00:16:44.367
So we need to look critically at how our incident management process,

00:16:44.567 --> 00:16:45.887
if you will, how we are doing that.

00:16:46.067 --> 00:16:48.347
So we actually started a small task force to say, hey, guys,

00:16:48.427 --> 00:16:51.807
let's look at academic references, research.

00:16:52.127 --> 00:16:55.967
Let's learn from our peers to say, OK, what can we do to actually learn better?

00:16:55.967 --> 00:16:59.927
Let's say learn first and all the incidents that in form of incident review

00:16:59.927 --> 00:17:01.467
panels or learning teams, if you will.

00:17:01.967 --> 00:17:05.607
And then also migrating, how can we learn more from the things that are going well?

00:17:06.187 --> 00:17:09.067
And learning from normal work, I think it's definitely one of the keys.

00:17:09.227 --> 00:17:13.027
And that's a difficult point, a difficult thing to get going.

00:17:13.247 --> 00:17:20.207
But so vital. I mean, it's just vital to what we do, the ability to learn. So what are you doing?

00:17:20.547 --> 00:17:23.767
What kind of questions are you getting the leaders to ask how have you changed

00:17:23.767 --> 00:17:28.567
their their curiosity hmm question i know i'm filled with good questions yeah

00:17:28.567 --> 00:17:33.047
that's i have a million yeah i know i understand but i only have three good answers.

00:17:33.927 --> 00:17:38.747
Truly now i think i've tried many things and i've also noticed that the questions

00:17:38.747 --> 00:17:43.327
that i like feed a certain person a certain senior lead will be different than

00:17:43.327 --> 00:17:47.147
for others for example my news let's say directly my my my manager i was just

00:17:47.147 --> 00:17:50.347
speaking to which is she maybe that makes a difference? I don't know.

00:17:50.787 --> 00:17:55.487
She's very attuned to asking those questions, being open, psychological safety, all that.

00:17:55.927 --> 00:17:59.187
But yeah, I have different leaders that are definitely brought up at a different

00:17:59.187 --> 00:18:02.347
time, think differently that way. So I'll feed them different things.

00:18:02.527 --> 00:18:05.747
And there I will be more intuitive. Okay. Are you aware of this,

00:18:05.847 --> 00:18:06.787
this and this playing out?

00:18:07.047 --> 00:18:10.647
And then I will also ask them, okay, do you, are you aware that the thing,

00:18:10.827 --> 00:18:14.227
the way you respond to this situation will have this effect?

00:18:14.627 --> 00:18:18.687
And sharing how that works or how this can play out at least helps them to acknowledge

00:18:18.687 --> 00:18:22.107
a bit better, okay, apparently what I've just said or the decision I just took

00:18:22.107 --> 00:18:25.367
came across something completely different because it's not what you say.

00:18:25.487 --> 00:18:26.387
It's also what people hear.

00:18:26.687 --> 00:18:29.607
And usually, you know, with the phone game, there's a little bit of muddle in

00:18:29.607 --> 00:18:30.667
between. Yeah, yeah, yeah, always.

00:18:31.087 --> 00:18:34.367
And I've noticed that everybody is just conscious of that. Do you notice,

00:18:34.507 --> 00:18:40.187
and this is a great question for you because you tend to sort of have your feet on many continents.

00:18:40.427 --> 00:18:44.667
Do you notice a different sense of curiosity with your European leadership team

00:18:44.667 --> 00:18:47.987
as opposed to leaders in the United States or even leaders in Latin America?

00:18:48.387 --> 00:18:52.107
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Most definitely. You know, we work internationally with many

00:18:52.107 --> 00:18:54.687
nationalities and it's different.

00:18:56.260 --> 00:19:00.380
Talking as well, because, well, I'm Dutchie. I think everybody probably knows

00:19:00.380 --> 00:19:02.440
that we tend to be quite blunt. Yes.

00:19:02.860 --> 00:19:07.580
I think that's the good part. First of all, be aware of your kind of cultural

00:19:07.580 --> 00:19:10.500
faults, but also be sensitive of cultural aspects of others.

00:19:11.100 --> 00:19:16.420
And I've read Weissman books. And for me, it's just, if you embrace curiosity

00:19:16.420 --> 00:19:19.960
in the widest sense, in any engagement that you may have in any continent with

00:19:19.960 --> 00:19:21.320
any leaders whatsoever, whatsoever.

00:19:21.780 --> 00:19:25.760
I think for me, that's the key to success because then you kind of are open

00:19:25.760 --> 00:19:27.900
towards the other, the viewpoints of the other person.

00:19:28.120 --> 00:19:30.560
It takes some time to reflect on that from beautiful perspectives.

00:19:30.860 --> 00:19:34.320
And then you hopefully you can use that to come to a middle ground that both

00:19:34.320 --> 00:19:36.080
of you will understand each other.

00:19:36.320 --> 00:19:41.500
But it means for if I'm in the US, I will speak differently than I'll be in Asia.

00:19:41.820 --> 00:19:43.960
Yeah. Asia for sure. Or even Latin America. Yeah.

00:19:44.360 --> 00:19:49.020
Are you doing much operational learning? Like you talked about learning from normal work.

00:19:49.180 --> 00:19:53.920
How are you tackling that? That's so hard to do because you do so much good normal work.

00:19:54.060 --> 00:19:59.860
I mean, it's more common than not that you do good technical complex work all the time.

00:20:00.120 --> 00:20:03.100
How do you pick what to learn from? It's a difficult one as well,

00:20:03.120 --> 00:20:07.800
because I think it's also important that certain aspects are there where they should be.

00:20:07.980 --> 00:20:11.180
For example, who am I to dictate how the guys on the work for on the team that

00:20:11.180 --> 00:20:12.920
we're going to visit have to do their work?

00:20:13.100 --> 00:20:16.160
I think we need to rely on the competency of the guys that we have or short,

00:20:16.380 --> 00:20:18.980
doing the high risk work to be capable to have that dialogue.

00:20:19.240 --> 00:20:23.560
So we have quite a nice structure, which we will have a bit of a flavor of this

00:20:23.560 --> 00:20:28.120
afternoon, is that we have supervisors that steer their lead their teams during

00:20:28.120 --> 00:20:30.700
the toolbox talks and actually have those engaging discussions.

00:20:31.080 --> 00:20:33.360
Okay, we're going to do a bit of work. This is going to happen.

00:20:33.520 --> 00:20:36.980
Is everybody aware to create that learning on the spot rather than being.

00:20:38.804 --> 00:20:41.664
What are you most proud of right now? What am I most proud of?

00:20:41.744 --> 00:20:44.604
That's a hard question. I got to think of it. That's a very work-related.

00:20:45.084 --> 00:20:48.024
I was going to say my kids. That's a very non-Dutch question.

00:20:48.604 --> 00:20:50.804
A Dutch question, I should say, what do you hate the most now?

00:20:51.004 --> 00:20:55.304
But no, what are you most proud of? What changes are having the biggest sticking power?

00:20:55.764 --> 00:21:00.524
For me, at the moment, it's definitely the team, the people that I'm working with.

00:21:00.844 --> 00:21:05.324
You know, the people that are working for, I think, here in my family-owned company.

00:21:05.784 --> 00:21:09.004
And I think we're a proud Dutch as well. So apologies for that.

00:21:09.224 --> 00:21:11.984
But there's definitely that family sentiment in our company,

00:21:12.204 --> 00:21:16.384
which I really love. That's probably also the reason why I'm already working here for 12 years.

00:21:16.644 --> 00:21:18.964
I would have never thought I would have been here for 12 years,

00:21:19.084 --> 00:21:20.844
but okay, it's been over 12 years now.

00:21:21.024 --> 00:21:23.684
And it's also mainly because of the people that we're working with.

00:21:23.864 --> 00:21:26.864
And they're all so freaking passionate about what we're doing.

00:21:27.144 --> 00:21:28.904
It's cool stuff that we're doing, right?

00:21:29.484 --> 00:21:33.484
It's almost like I've talked with a colleague recently and it was about,

00:21:33.684 --> 00:21:37.544
we were kind of really like cross with the fact that currently the amount of

00:21:37.544 --> 00:21:40.124
kids, that want to go to an art school college, it's depleting.

00:21:40.564 --> 00:21:42.744
And we just don't understand why.

00:21:43.224 --> 00:21:47.224
We need to just take the center stage more to talk about our profession with

00:21:47.224 --> 00:21:51.264
fashion because it is a fantastic world to work and live in.

00:21:51.764 --> 00:21:57.204
But yeah, I can imagine a newer generation. It doesn't look as cool anymore like 20 years ago.

00:21:57.444 --> 00:22:00.204
And that's an interesting, I mean, that's a really interesting problem.

00:22:00.504 --> 00:22:04.384
But one of the advantages I think you have is it seems like there's a high need

00:22:04.384 --> 00:22:08.264
now for workers to have a sense of connectedness.

00:22:08.444 --> 00:22:12.944
And you guys do that pretty well. What do you think the trick to that is?

00:22:13.424 --> 00:22:17.964
I think there is investing in that connection and investing in that family sense.

00:22:18.204 --> 00:22:22.924
I think anybody who started for Adhere might be offshore or onshore always got

00:22:22.924 --> 00:22:28.524
like, I think there was a visual, we had a seminar quite a while ago with Project

00:22:28.524 --> 00:22:29.684
Manage about Dare to Care.

00:22:31.603 --> 00:22:34.703
And we had a lady that visualizes, you know, draws and things. Those are cool.

00:22:34.983 --> 00:22:39.563
And she also drew a drawing of, like, the sentiment she felt in the room.

00:22:39.763 --> 00:22:43.663
So, like, kind of what is not separate, what she felt. And she actually drew a warm bath.

00:22:44.203 --> 00:22:46.823
Oh, nice. That's a term that we tend to use, you know, it feels like coming

00:22:46.823 --> 00:22:48.503
home, entering a warm bath.

00:22:48.663 --> 00:22:52.103
And I've heard multiple people saying that when, oh, when I started hearing

00:22:52.103 --> 00:22:53.563
it, it almost felt like a warm bath.

00:22:53.883 --> 00:22:57.043
But we can also be a picky family, to be honest. We can also be kind of cross.

00:22:57.423 --> 00:23:01.043
As all families are, right? That's normal. We are a true family business in that sense.

00:23:01.603 --> 00:23:05.283
What's the future look like? What's next? For here, man? Yeah, for you.

00:23:05.643 --> 00:23:10.063
I think, you know, we've moved into renewables. I think offshore decommissioning

00:23:10.063 --> 00:23:11.963
is also a very big market.

00:23:12.323 --> 00:23:16.083
I think the sky is the limit in that sense. You know, there's so many new cool

00:23:16.083 --> 00:23:21.603
things happening in the world that we can kind of deliver our services, if you will, for.

00:23:22.743 --> 00:23:26.663
And, yeah, I see us going to the next level. I want to share the story of what

00:23:26.663 --> 00:23:30.963
we've done, the story of Dare to Care, why in the world even, if you ask me.

00:23:31.603 --> 00:23:35.003
And that's why I'm so glad that we're going to talk and meet with a lot of our

00:23:35.003 --> 00:23:35.983
subcontractors as well.

00:23:36.043 --> 00:23:40.123
Because for me, the end is not our company here. It's also extended towards

00:23:40.123 --> 00:23:43.543
the people that work on our behalf, irrespective of where they are.

00:23:44.123 --> 00:23:47.623
And truly, truly got an investment in safety in the widest.

00:23:50.640 --> 00:23:57.520
Music.

00:23:57.183 --> 00:24:01.003
So what do you think? I told you. I mean, it was a super interesting conversation.

00:24:01.603 --> 00:24:07.463
And actually, the potential for us to return to this conversation is pretty high.

00:24:07.923 --> 00:24:13.283
In fact, I'm really excited about the chance to talk more about what they're doing.

00:24:13.423 --> 00:24:17.443
They're about to embark on this supergiant project, which is kind of how we

00:24:17.443 --> 00:24:19.483
met. I mean, it's gigantic.

00:24:19.943 --> 00:24:27.283
It's actually four gigantic projects. And so they're really working carefully

00:24:27.283 --> 00:24:31.723
in setting the work up before the work begins.

00:24:32.611 --> 00:24:36.651
And so one of the things they're doing is they're meeting with the contractor

00:24:36.651 --> 00:24:42.111
leadership of all the contractor organizations that will work with them in these

00:24:42.111 --> 00:24:47.911
projects and kind of setting the tone and the expectations and having conversations

00:24:47.911 --> 00:24:50.191
around, well, what does SAFE look like?

00:24:50.211 --> 00:24:52.851
How are we going to respond when we fail?

00:24:53.031 --> 00:24:58.491
Who's accountable to ensure this is how we communicate with one another?

00:24:58.491 --> 00:25:06.711
And it's a really important and significant way to build really that sense of

00:25:06.711 --> 00:25:10.351
accountability throughout the project. Because we've said it a million times,

00:25:10.651 --> 00:25:13.051
might as well say it one more time because it's worth hearing.

00:25:13.611 --> 00:25:17.391
Accountability is a conversation you have before something bad happens.

00:25:17.571 --> 00:25:21.411
And really, accountability is an act of clarification.

00:25:22.371 --> 00:25:28.111
It's not an act of indemnification or causality or blaming.

00:25:28.491 --> 00:25:33.271
It's none of those things. What it does is it clarifies the expectations.

00:25:33.911 --> 00:25:39.591
Who's accountable to do what? And you have that conversation before that person

00:25:39.591 --> 00:25:41.531
needs to do the thing they needed to do.

00:25:42.031 --> 00:25:47.471
And in a big project like this, with lots of eyes, lots of stakeholders,

00:25:48.091 --> 00:25:53.071
lots of pressure, and a tremendous amount of risk, you'll never go too far wrong

00:25:53.071 --> 00:25:57.731
preparing the soil carefully because you're about to plant the seed.

00:25:57.891 --> 00:25:59.051
That's the project itself.

00:25:59.491 --> 00:26:03.931
But the preparation for the soil is really what's going to make the project

00:26:03.931 --> 00:26:06.811
most successful. And that's kind of what we saw happen.

00:26:07.091 --> 00:26:12.071
And that's why I wanted to spend a little time in a conversation with just the

00:26:12.071 --> 00:26:13.811
three of us, you, myself, and beyond that.

00:26:14.291 --> 00:26:19.251
We were able to kind of listen in and talk about where they've come from,

00:26:19.511 --> 00:26:23.291
where they're going, and what they're thinking about now.

00:26:23.391 --> 00:26:26.291
And I think it's a good way to spend time.

00:26:26.331 --> 00:26:30.991
And it's a super good way to enjoy the conversations we have,

00:26:31.011 --> 00:26:34.511
and all of us get the chance to learn from them. So that's it.

00:26:34.611 --> 00:26:35.351
That's the conversation.

00:26:35.791 --> 00:26:40.231
Today is a great day, and I'm so cool to spend it with you. Tell your friends,

00:26:40.511 --> 00:26:42.511
like and subscribe, whatever that means.

00:26:42.731 --> 00:26:45.011
Smash the like button, all those kind of things.

00:26:45.451 --> 00:26:48.911
Mostly, I'm glad you're here. And share this with anybody you need to.

00:26:49.071 --> 00:26:52.411
You know that it's all there for you guys.

00:26:52.591 --> 00:26:55.771
Until then, learn something new every single day. Have as much fun as you possibly

00:26:55.771 --> 00:27:00.071
can. Be good to each other. Be kind to each other. And for goodness sakes, you guys, be safe.

00:27:01.840 --> 00:27:11.821
Music.