Recorded live at Meow Wolf in Santa Fe, this episode features a wide-ranging conversation between Todd and Andy Baker about learning, safety culture, and leadership influence.
They dig into HOP and related safety approaches, debate top-down versus middle-out change, discuss the importance of language and unlearning, and explore how to turn belief into practical skill and behavior.
The episode offers real-world insights on piloting change, engaging leaders and middle managers, and learning from others who have adapted these ideas in novel ways.
PAPod 567 - Open Questions 2025: From Metrics to Monitors — Rethinking Safety
Episode: an extended open Q&A from the Pre-Accident Investigation Conference in
PAPod 566 - Blame Stops Improvement: How Blame Silences Learning
Todd Conklin explores how blame shuts down learning and prevents organizational
PAPod 565 - Fear, FOMO & Fixing Safety: A Conversation with Brent Sutton
Todd Conklin and Brent Sutton discuss the short-term future of safety thinking—c
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